为什么日本在技术和经济上比韩国更先进？-pg电子麻将胡了

mev shreb
japan started it’s industrialisation way back during the meiji restoration, 1869. essentially the usa just prior came to japan, threatened the japanese into signing unfair treaties, and probably were planning a colonisation attempt eventually.
the japanese panicked for their existence, the most powerful japanese domains got behind the emperor and they overthrew the shogun, the shogun ran off up into hokkaido, but eventually gave up and become a nobody after that.

日本的工业化始于1869年的明治维新。实际上，在此之前，美国逼迫日本签署不平等条约，并可能计划进行殖民统治。
日本人因生存受到威胁而感到恐慌，最强大的日本藩国支持天皇，推翻了幕府。幕府将军逃到了北海道，但最终放弃了，成为了一个无名小卒。

this is also known as a bloodless war, because there wasn’t much death, most japanese thought the shogun was incompetent and thought the country was not doing too well, so they wanted to change directions. so there wasn’t much resistance to overthrowing the shogun.

这也被称为一场不流血的战争因为没有太多的死亡，大多数日本人认为幕府无能，认为这个国家做得不好，所以他们想改变方向。所以推翻幕府将军的反抗并不强烈。

the actual military industrialisation if you want to call it that, actually started even slightly prior, such as around in the early 1860’s. japan after the emperor was the ruler again, it focused all it’s effort on modernising the military ahead of any other sector, with the rational that without a powerful military, you in essence have no national security. japan understood that you can’t expect countries to not attack japan, just because japan didn’t attack them. the only thing that would stop an attack, if if japan had a powerful army to make them think twice.
so this is what happened.

真正的军事工业化，如果你想这么称呼它的话，实际上开始得更早一些，比如在19世纪60年代早期。日本天皇再次成为统治者后，它把所有的精力都集中在军事现代化上，而不是其他任何领域，理由是没有强大的军队，你本质上就没有国家安全。日本明白，你不能指望其他国家不攻击日本，仅仅因为日本没有攻击他们。唯一能阻止进攻的，是如果日本有一支强大的军队让他们三思而后行。
这就是发生的事情。

by around the 1880’s japan had also modernised in other fields however, like in chemistry, engineering, medicine etc. again, most of this was via japanese scholars going to europe, bringing back anything useful for japan. these scholars were of upper class, they didn’t bring back or care about the culture that existed in europe, and instead perceived it as inferior to japan’s. however they recognised that in europe the fields of technology and science were ahead, and that japan had to go there and gather this knowledge.

到1880年代，日本在其他领域也进行了现代化，比如化学、工程、医学等。大多数这些进步是通过日本学者前往欧洲获得的，他们将任何对日本有用的东西带了回来。这些学者大多来自上层阶级，他们并没有带回或关心欧洲的文化，而是认为其文化低于日本。然而，他们意识到欧洲在技术和科学领域处于领先地位，因此日本必须去那里汲取知识。

thus japan didn’t undergo “westernisation” in a sense, it underwent technological modernisation. because japan retained it’s culture, it’s religion, it’s language, writing, customs etc. it merely took back useful technology and understanding of certain fields that would be useful for japan’s modernisation.

因此，日本并没有在某种意义上经历“西方化”，而是进行了技术现代化。因为日本保留了自己的文化、宗教、语言、文字、习俗等。它只是带回了对日本现代化有用的技术和对某些领域的理解。

south korea’s history is a lot different. south korea never got to modernise itself, instead it’s first modernisation occurred via the japanese who invaded and took over korea. the japanese essentially took all of their industrial knowledge that they had in japan, and replicated it over in korea and even manchuria. and within just 2 decades korea went from the equivalent of a country stuck in the 1400’s, to now a country in the early 1900’s.

韩国的历史则大不相同。韩国从来没有实现过自己的现代化，相反，它的第一次现代化是通过入侵并占领朝鲜的日本人实现的。日本人基本上把他们在日本拥有的所有工业知识，复制到了朝鲜，甚至满洲。在短短20年的时间里，韩国从一个相当于被困在14世纪的国家，变成了现在一个处于20世纪初的国家。

japan even printed the first hangul newspapers, and brought back hangul teaching in korean schools. this is because the japanese didn’t want the chinese scxt replacing the native korean one.
then japan was mass bombed in ww2, japanese from most areas in asia went back to japan (some remained obviously, but most left).

日本甚至印刷了第一批韩文报纸，并在韩国学校推广了韩文教学。这是因为日本不希望汉字取代本土的朝鲜文字。然后，日本在二战中遭到大规模轰炸，来自亚洲大部分地区的日本人返回了日本（显然有一些留下来，但大多数都离开了）。

this created a power vacuum in korea, who were the rulers?
what occurred is that chinese and russian type forces moved into the north of korea, this was happening at the very end of ww2 btw, just shortly after the japanese left.
the usa noticed what was happening and then sent it’s own forces into korea, into the south of korea. the country was then split into two, and the north fell to com...ism.

这在韩国造成了权力真空，谁是统治者呢？发生的事情是，中国和俄罗斯的军队进入了韩国北部，这发生在第二次世界大战结束之际，正是在日本撤离不久之后。美国注意到了这一情况，随后也派遣自己的军队进入朝鲜，进驻韩国南部。于是这个国家被分成了两部分，北部陷入了gczy。

then by 1950, the korean war starts. north korea is largely destroyed in the korean war. virtually every city, factory etc in north korea was destroyed.
therefore, nearly every modernisation the japanese had once built there, north korea was instantly sent back by that all being bombed and destroyed in the korean war (a crazy war that killed around 5 million people).

然后到1950年，朝鲜战争开始。朝鲜在战争中遭到严重破坏。几乎每个城市、工厂等都被摧毁。因此，曾经日本在朝鲜建立的几乎所有现代化成果，在朝鲜战争中都被轰炸和摧毁了（这是一场疯狂的战争，造成了约500万人死亡）。

here is what happened to nk, and accounts from american soldiers admit that “we destroyed everything in our wake, every town, village” etc. and you don’t have to take those soldier’s accounts for it, the photos also show it.

这就是朝鲜的遭遇，美国士兵的证言承认“我们摧毁了我们经过的每一个地方，每个城镇、村庄”等等。而且你不必只依靠士兵的证言，照片也证实了这一点。

there was literally nothing left of north korea, and it was chinese solders that marched into nk that eventually resulted in sk’s and americans retreating and the war ending.
south korea took city damage also, but because south korea had more cities and towns and a larger population, a lot of it’s stuff also wasn’t destroyed.

朝鲜几乎一无所有，最终是中国士兵进入朝鲜，导致了韩国和美军的撤退，以及战争的结束。韩国也遭受了城市的破坏，但由于韩国拥有更多的城市和城镇，以及更大的人口，很多地方并没有被摧毁。

therefore after the korean war, nk got set back heavily, and the chinese who then took over kind of unofficially administering nk, the chinese didn’t give the nk’s everything they needed.
you have to understand, that for china, they like the nk’s to be able to have weapons and be able to punch back, however the chinese don’t necessarily want to aid nk outside of that, meaning china doesn’t want to aid nk’s tech, automotive, farming, business venture etc to the point that nk doesn’t need china anymore.
china wants to keep nk in a situation where it needs china, so china effectively has control of it.
so nk has been kept in essentially a depressed state, on purpose.

因此，朝鲜战争后，朝鲜遭受了严重的倒退，而当时中国在一定程度上非正式地管理朝鲜，实际上并没有给予朝鲜所需的一切。你必须明白，对于中国来说，他们希望朝鲜能够拥有武器并能够反击，但中国并不一定想在其他方面支持朝鲜，这意味着中国不想在科技、汽车、农业、商业等方面援助朝鲜，以至于朝鲜不再需要中国。因此，朝鲜一直处于一种本质上处于萧条的状态，这是故意的。

now for south korea, the south koreans took over rebuilding infrastructure right at the end of the korean war. some japanese stuff remained, but the south koreans built way more stuff since then.but ultimately speaking, the south koreans just haven’t had as long to modernise or develop as the japanese have.

至于韩国，韩国人在朝鲜战争结束时接手了基础设施的重建。一些日本的设施仍然存在，但自那时以来，韩国人建设了更多的东西。但归根结底，韩国人没有像日本人那样有那么长的时间进行现代化或发展。

that’s why south korea still lags a bit in areas. however south korea as of today, i think anyone obxtive would call it a developed country. it’s literally way more technological than most of the countries in europe (that get to be called developed).
south koreans have had around 69 years of peace, to continually develop.

这就是为什么韩国在某些领域仍然稍显落后。然而，至今的韩国，我认为任何客观的人都会称其为发达国家。它在科技方面实际上远远超过了大多数被称为发达国家的欧洲国家。韩国人已经享受了大约69年的和平，以持续发展。

andrew li
i have got to disagree with this statement: "japan even printed the first hangul newspapers, and brought back hangul teaching in korean schools"
it paints a false picture that japan's invasion was good for korea. korea lost so much during the japanese occupation. korean as a language ws banned in classrooms. koreans were urged to switch to using japanese names. newspaper stations were shut down from printing in korean. the 30 years of occupation was brutal and koreans suffered enormously during that time.

我必须不同意这个说法：“日本甚至印刷了第一批韩文报纸，并在韩国学校恢复了韩文教学。”这给人一种错误的印象，认为日本的侵略对韩国是有益的。韩国在日本占领期间损失惨重。韩语在课堂上被禁止使用，韩国人被迫改用日本名字，报社被关闭，无法用韩文印刷。长达30年的占领是残酷的，韩国人在这段时间遭受了巨大的痛苦。

"this is because the japanese didn’t want the chinese scxt replacing the native korean one" is also a false statement.
korea has been using chinese characters since ancient times. hangul was invented in the 1400s and was continuously used for grammatical placement. it's only after the korean war when it was made the official scxt for the koreas. the japnese were doing the absolute opposite, they were trying to get rid of anything distinctly korean and tried to replace it with japanese.

“这是因为日本人不希望汉字取代本土的朝鲜文字”也是一个错误的说法。朝鲜自古以来就一直使用汉字。韩文是在15世纪发明的，并在语法上不断使用。直到朝鲜战争之后，韩文才成为朝鲜的官方文字。日本人则做的完全相反，他们试图消除任何具有明显韩国特色的东西，并试图用日本文化取而代之。

tony tan
both are the us poodle colonies.
japan is polite and very evil.
south korea is barbaric and insane.
it appears that the polite and very evil entity has prevailed over the barbaric and insane entity in the short term.

两者都是美国的“殖民地”。
日本礼貌而又非常邪恶。
韩国则野蛮而疯狂。
看起来在短期内，礼貌且非常邪恶的实体战胜了野蛮且疯狂的实体。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处

intellix
japan's heavy industry was built up with the help of the u.s. involvement in the korean war when there was no south korea.
later, the japanese economy once almost surpassed the u.s., and after the plaza accord the japanese purchased large amounts of overseas assets.
the japanese economy has a head start and a strong principal. even when japan's economy stagnated after the plaza accord, it remained richer than the vast majority of countries for many years.

日本的重工业是在美国参与朝鲜战争的帮助下建立起来的，当时还没有韩国。后来，日本经济一度几乎超过美国，并在广场协议后大量购买海外资产。日本经济有着先发优势和强大的基础。即使在广场协议后，日本经济陷入停滞，但在许多年里，其财富仍然高于绝大多数国家。

alex kim
i don’t think that’s necessarily true anymore. sure, there are certain aspects of japanese infrastructure and technology that is more advanced than south korea’s, but those are usually due to differences in needs and economic structures.
for example, japan’s most famous piece of infrastructure is its bullet train network, which beats south korea’s in many ways. however, the reason why japan needs and continues to invest in its rail network is because japan itself is long, making rail an extremely efficient way to connect the whole country. in addition, japan has several stretches of flat land, which allows trains to actually achieve their maximum speeds.

我并不认为这现在仍然成立。确实，日本在某些基础设施和技术方面比韩国更先进，但这些通常是由于需求和经济结构的不同。例如，日本最著名的基础设施是其高速铁路网络，在许多方面超过韩国的铁路。然而，日本需要并继续投资于其铁路网络的原因是因为日本本身很长，铁路是连接整个国家的极为高效的方式。此外，日本有几段平坦的土地，这使得列车能够达到最大速度。

meanwhile, south korea is smaller, square-ish, and doesn’t have as many large plains. thus, any advances in maximum speed or whatever won’t result in as-significant reductions in travel times.
besides rail, i’ve never heard of japanese infrastructure being noticeably better than south korea’s. both countries maintain their roads very well, and seoul and tokyo’s subway systems are both world-class.

相比之下，韩国的面积较小，形状较为方正，没有那么多大平原。因此，在最大速度或其他方面的任何进步都不会显著减少旅行时间。除了铁路，我没有听说过日本的基础设施明显优于韩国的地方。两国的道路维护得都很好，首尔和东京的地铁系统都是世界级的。

kevin lim
okay, i’ll compare with south korea, for north korea is… uh… you know, right?
japan started to advance in those fields earlier than korea.
and factors like population and land size are bigger.
also, the backup of the basic science from the government is larger in japan. recently, the south korean government decided to reduce them. of course, people opposed it.
and in several parts, korea is advanced but japan has many cool research. entirely, still, japan can be the winner! cheer up!

好的，我会和韩国比较，因为朝鲜是，嗯，你知道的，对吧？
日本在这些领域的进步早于韩国。人口和土地面积等因素影响很大。此外，日本在基础科学方面的政府支持也更为强大。最近，韩国政府决定减少对基础科学的支持，当然，这引起了民众的反对。
在几个方面，韩国是先进的，但日本在许多研究领域也很出色。整体来看，日本仍然可以被视为赢家！振作起来吧！

economy! the modern economic history of the two countries is both full of miracles. the data below are based on english wikipedia. in the past, japan was a way more advanced country but nowadays, we need to compare those.
the nominal gdp of japan(#4) is 2.5 times bigger than korea(#13). and their ppp(#4) is 2.2 times bigger than korea(#14). their population is 126m(#11), which is 2.47 times more, while korea has 51m(#29).

经济!两国的近代经济史都充满了奇迹。以下数据基于英文维基百科。在过去，日本是一个更先进的国家，但现在，我们需要比较它们。
日本（第4名）的名义gdp是韩国（第13名）的2.5倍。他们的购买力平价（排名第4）比韩国（排名第14）高2.2倍。他们的人口是1.26亿（排名第11），是美国的2.47倍，而韩国有5100万（排名第29）。

gdp growth, korea recorded 2.0% and japan recorded 1.3%. cheer up!
gdp per capita, korea(nominal #31 / ppp #29) can catch up with japan(nominal #30 / ppp #34) next year! the gap is smaller than $800! beware!
but korea has a worse unemployment rate. hdi is the same, but for idhi, japan is higher, 0.012.

韩国的gdp增长率为2.0%，日本为1.3%。加油！
人均gdp方面，韩国（名义#31 / ppp #29）明年有望赶上日本（名义#30 / ppp #34），差距小于800美元！要小心哦！
不过，韩国的失业率较高。人类发展指数（hdi）相同，但调整后的hdi（idhi）日本更高，差距为 0.012。

let’s see government debt. korea first; 39.8% of gdp! alright, let’s see japan. uh, 263.9% of gdp? i wonder what happened, but cheers. hope japan can pay them…
credit rating, korea has higher credit ratings from standard & poor’s, moody’s, fitch…
japan has 2.7 times more foreign reserves.

让我们看看政府债务。韩国的债务占gdp的39.8%！好吧，那我们再看看日本。呃，263.9%？我想知道发生了什么，但祝好运，希望日本能还清这些债务…
信用评级方面，韩国在标准普尔、穆迪、惠誉的评级都更高…
而日本的外汇储备是韩国的2.7倍。

arunava mookerjee
since the late 19th century japan had been making strenuous efforts to match the then dominant european powers, britain, france and russia in technological development and military power. it's military power was completely destroyed by the americans in 1945, but by then it had the intellectual reserve capacity to revive its industrial infrastructure. it proved this to such an extent that by 1969 it was the second biggest economic power in the world, behind the usa and some way ahead of britain, germany and france. even today it is in 3rd position, china being in the 2nd.

自19世纪末以来，日本一直在努力赶上当时主导的欧洲列强——英国、法国和俄罗斯，在技术发展和军事力量方面。1945年，美国彻底摧毁了其军事力量，但到那时日本已经具备了恢复工业基础设施的智力储备。到1969年，它已经成为世界上第二大经济大国，仅次于美国，在某种程度上领先于英国、德国和法国。。即使在今天，它仍然排在第三位，中国则位居第二。

korea became independent in 1945 from japanese occupation. the japanese colonizers used korea as a source of cheap manpower and as a bridgehead to the resources of northern china. one benefit that the japanese occupiers had left for the koreans was that the korean workers, though paid less wages, developed the japanese style working efficiency and work ethics. the korean war further damaged the republic of korea. korea started developing industrially and technologically in 1969. it followed more or less japanese economic and management model with which they had become familiar during japanese occupation before 1945. rok grew rapidly competing japan in similar industries and products.

朝鲜于1945年从日本占领下独立。日本殖民者将朝鲜作为廉价劳动力的来源，并作为获取中国北方资源的桥头堡。日本占领者留给朝鲜人的一个好处是，虽然工资较低，但朝鲜工人培养了日本式的工作效率和职业道德。朝鲜战争进一步损害了朝鲜的经济。朝鲜在1969年开始了工业和技术的发展。它在一定程度上遵循了在1945年之前日本占领期间熟悉的日本经济和管理模式。朝鲜迅速发展，开始在相似的产业和产品上与日本竞争。

japan had a long head start on technological development over korea. naturally, even now, it is on more favourable ground in technology over korea.

日本在技术发展上对韩国有很长的领先优势。自然，即使在今天，它在技术上仍然处于比韩国更有利的位置。

bruce hyland
japan ranks 19th on the hdi, and rok ranks 23rd. japan’s median wealth per capita is $112,980 (16th) with a gini of 64.4, while rok’s is $89,671 (22nd) with a gini of 67.6. there’s really almost nothing to choose between them, allowing for statistical errors in the data. if japan has a slight advantage, it’s because it was industrialized well before ww2, whereas rok was a japanese vassal state and did not even begin to modernize until the 1970s.
i remember visiting the first car factory in rok. it was such an amateur operation that i could not believe it would ever amount to anything. was i ever wrong!

日本在 hdi 排名中位列第 19，韩国则位列第 23。日本的人均中位财富为 112,980 美元（第 16），基尼系数为 64.4，而韩国的人均中位财富为 89,671 美元（第 22），基尼系数为 67.6。考虑到数据中的统计误差，它们之间几乎没有什么可选择的。如果说日本有一点优势，那是因为它在二战前就已经工业化了，而韩国是日本的附属国，直到20世纪70年代才开始现代化。
我记得访问韩国的第一家汽车工厂，那真是一个业余操作，我根本无法相信它会有什么前途。结果我错得很离谱

dangling legs giraffe
i believe rok did not exist back in wwii when whole korean peninsula was under japanese occupation and was regarded as “japan proper”.

我认为在二战期间，韩国并不存在，当时整个朝鲜半岛都在日本占领之下，被视为“日本本土”。

yuniko
south korea gdp per capita: 48.000$
japanese gdp per capita: 42.000$
south korean hdi: 0.916
japanese hdi: 0.895
south korea’s innovations: 1st place in the world.
japanese innovations: 6th place in the world.
south korean gdp growth: 4% per year
japanese gdp growth: -1% per year
south korean global rank: aaa
japanese global rank: a

韩国人均gdp：48,000美元
日本人均gdp：42,000美元
韩国hdi：0.916
日本hdi：0.895
韩国的创新：世界第一
日本的创新：世界第六
韩国gdp增长：每年4%
日本gdp增长：每年-1%
韩国全球评级：aaa
日本全球评级：a

bruce hyland
japan is 19th on the hdi with a 0.919, while rok is 23rd with a 0.916. gdp per capita is a meaningless statistic: it just shows that there are a few rich people but gives no indication of general living standards. median wealth per capita is higher in japan than in rok, and the gini is lower, so the average standard of living is superior in japan.

日本在hdi排名中位列第19，分数为0.919，而韩国位列第23，分数为0.916。人均gdp是一个无意义的统计数据，它仅显示少数富人，却无法反映整体生活水平。日本的人均中位财富高于韩国，基尼系数较低，因此日本的平均生活水平更高。

remko popma
this is a really simple question to answer.
both korea and japan are societies modeled upon confucian principles. confucius taught that above all else, education and social order were the most important things for keeping a harmonious and productive society. this means that, embedded into the core of the national psyche, is a fundamental respect for education.
the benefit of this is that instead of smart academic achievers being seen as outcasts, dorky and nerdy as they are in “western” countries, they are actually considered desirable traits by both men and women.

这个问题的答案很简单。
韩国和日本都是以儒家原则为基础的社会。孔子教导，教育和社会秩序是维持和谐与高效社会的最重要因素。这意味着，尊重教育已经深入国家的核心心理。
这一点的好处在于，聪明的学术 achievers 不会像在“西方”国家那样被视为边缘人物或书呆子，而是被男性和女性所欣赏。

this means that a very high proportion of women as well as men end up going into the science, engineering and technology sectors.
these are the people that research, design and build technology and that is why japan and korea are both highly technologically advanced countries but at the same time, they are also highly bureaucratic (which you could blame on confucius too).
confucian fundamentals mixed with free market capitalist driving forces and a lack of social stigma against academic achievement is the answer you are looking for.

这意味着，许多女性和男性最终进入科学、工程和技术领域。这些人负责研究、设计和构建技术，因此日本和韩国都是高度发达的科技国家，但同时它们也高度官僚（这也可以归咎于儒家思想）。
儒家基本原则与自由市场资本主义驱动力的结合，以及对学术成就没有社会污名，这是你正在寻找的答案。